Christianity in India watch thread

News and Discussions about politics, current affairs, international relations, economy, elections, state level politics etc.
This forum is strictly moderated.
Post Reply
Muns
Forum Moderator
Posts: 624
Joined: Mon Oct 02, 2017 6:01 am
Has thanked: 1 time
Been thanked: 5 times

Christianity in India watch thread

Post by Muns » Sun Jan 03, 2021 10:58 pm

Decided to open up another thread here to document the rising attacks by Christians on Hindus in India. Multiple states currently are affected especially the South and of course long-standing over Northeast India.
With the increasing evangelism, of Andhra backed by evangelist Jagan Reddy, we are increasingly seeing a spate of attacks by Christians on temples. The psyche with regard to evangelism as well as Christian history in its terror of native religions worldwide I think as well is something that I will continue to try and expand on this thread.

Idol of Hindu God found vandalised in Vizianagaram district, Opposition blames Jagan-led- govt for such incidents

https://www.india-aware.com/latest/idol ... incidents/
Barely a few days passed that an idol of Lord Ram had been found desecrated by some unknown miscreants at Ramatheertham in Vizianagaram district, in Andhra Pradesh. This is not the first instance when such an incident has occurred where Hindu sentiments have been hurt. Recently there was another case when a temple priest of Vigneshwara temple found idol of Sri Lord Subrahmanya vandalised with two cut-off limbs of the idol lying at the base of the statue.

Also, 400-yea- old idol of Lord Ram was found beheaded by the temple priest in the ancient Sita Lakshmana Kodandarama temple. As the regular prayers would begin in the mornings, the temple priest visited the sanctum sanctorum to perform pooja in the temple. To his utter shock, the doors of the temple were found broken and the idol of the God inside the sanctum sactorum was found headless. After the Police were called on immediately, most odf the severed parts of the idol has been retained from the surrounding pond. A case has been registered with the police in this regard.

Muns
Forum Moderator
Posts: 624
Joined: Mon Oct 02, 2017 6:01 am
Has thanked: 1 time
Been thanked: 5 times

Re: Christianity in India watch thread

Post by Muns » Sun Jan 03, 2021 11:00 pm

X post from the Politics thread ;
Chetakji,

What you posted above is an extremely important point. Unfortunately, even I today missed this event. It has me thinking about what is the best way to tackle the idea of Christmas which has only grown from strength to strength and has become only stronger in an Indian context.
Historically of course we know that celebrations around 25 December were associated with many native traditions around the world. Usually this involves the winter solstice including the end of the month in the Hindu calendar of Makar Sankranti.

Traditionally however the winter solstice is an important date among many native religions. This includes native religions not only in India but in ancient Germanic, Norse and Roman religion as well.
December 21-31 was celebrated by the Norse as the winter solstice and the knowledge that spring would soon be appearing. Evergreen trees were brought into houses to symbolize the coming of the spring. During this time, festivities and prayers to Odin would be commonplace.
Saturnalia, and gift giving was popular among Romans among this time as well.

For more austere Romans, December 25 was the birth date of Mithras, the all unconquering Sun God, and the celebrations therein. Christians could not stop citizens from celebrating these holidays so they decided to accommodate these holidays simply as the birth of Christ. Everybody seems to have really forgotten what these holidays were really about.

What is disturbing, what I see is the overwhelming support among Indian society with regard to Christmas. I myself have taken a different approach. I dont celebrate Christmas but I have tried to point out to those that Christmas or Christ-Mass… Was simply a frustration among the Christians in trying to stamp out native religions and simply decided to accommodate them.
Of course, knowing I feel that Christianity is simply accommodated these traditions, is important. With the rising return of Native religions among Europe, I feel that it is important for us to do the same as well.

Make then Gita Jayanti a standard every year when it comes to December 25 so that we as Indians can remember that this is unchanged and forward to look to. Start to incorporate Christmas from a different angle into the Indian sphere. Let us talk about the pre-Christian native religions of Europe and them being the origin of Christmas identity. Over time, eliminate and purge Christian and biblical ideas regarding the nativity date.
Hopefully what we can aim for is not where everybody is not wearing a red cap, honoring St. Nicholas, but understanding that Christian traditions go back far in times celebrating the old gods of Norse and Roman ancestry.

In time, Gita Jayanti may take on a different light with regard to Odin and Mithras all listening to Shri Krishna’s message… Even more, it will highlight the fact to Indians that Christians over the centuries have only done what they do best, incompletely taking other religions and calling it as their own.
What we have seen over the last few decades is a surge in Native religions in Europe.

Dissatisfied, with centuries of violence and persecution by Christians, Native religion is among the fatest growing religions in the world.

Their history and stories lost, is a void that we may be able to fill....Mithras gone? What if we were to fill the void of Mithras by having others understand to universality of Indian thought. Mithras is Surya and eventually a aspect of Brahman himself?

What does everyone think?

Muns
Forum Moderator
Posts: 624
Joined: Mon Oct 02, 2017 6:01 am
Has thanked: 1 time
Been thanked: 5 times

Re: Christianity in India watch thread

Post by Muns » Thu Jan 07, 2021 6:05 am

Been listening to some audio lectures and I thought to post some of the highlights here. Will keep adding as a listen to more.

Taken from The Greatest controversies of the early Christian history by Bart D Ehrman

Birth of Jesus

1) Disciples of Jesus all spoke in Aramaic and were illiterate. They are not the ones to of the Gospels.
2) Gospels were written approximately 60-100 years later by educated Greeks from oral tradition.
3) Gospels of only Luke and Matthew mentioned that he was born in Bethlehem.
4) Mention off a worldwide census in the above Gospels but no historical record during the time of Augustus.
5) Both Matthew and Luke really wanted Jesus to be born in Bethlehem because that is the Jewish tradition of where the Messiah will come from.
6) Jesus most likely born and raised in small town of Nazareth.

Muns
Forum Moderator
Posts: 624
Joined: Mon Oct 02, 2017 6:01 am
Has thanked: 1 time
Been thanked: 5 times

Re: Christianity in India watch thread

Post by Muns » Sun Jan 10, 2021 5:40 am

These are only short tidbits that I remember from the lectures. However, it may be important for some with regard to debates and for further investigation.

1) The concept of a virgin birth is a core part of the foundation faith of Christianity.

2) Only two gospels again really detailed the virgin birth. Matthew and Luke.

3) Matthew, references the origin of the virgin birth from Jewish Hebrew Scripture of Issiah.

4) The Hebrew Scripture of the young lady got translated into Greek which can also mean young lady or young virgin.

5) The context of the Hebrew scripture in Issiah references an already pregnant young lady who by the time she gives birth, God would’ve helped the king of Judah by removing enemies on his border.

6) Matthew picked up on this to mean the coming of the Messiah. He then needed to fit the Scripture of the virgin birth… Which unfortunately is mistranslation from Hebrew to Greek of young lady to mean young virgin.

7) In Luke, the concept of virgin birth means that the “holy spirit” descended upon Mary. As in God having a son called Jesus.

8) This concept of God having mortal sons goes back to all Greek and Roman tradition. Zeus had many mortal sons including Hercules. Historical spinoffs of Zeus’s sons even include Alexander the great. Greeks had no trouble with Gods having sex with mortals but Christians had trouble with this idea and so Luke may have used centuries old tradition by the Holy Spirit.

Muns
Forum Moderator
Posts: 624
Joined: Mon Oct 02, 2017 6:01 am
Has thanked: 1 time
Been thanked: 5 times

Re: Christianity in India watch thread

Post by Muns » Tue Jan 12, 2021 6:58 am

Behind The Attack On Temples In Andhra Pradesh: Why It Has Taken Such A Serious Turn Now

https://swarajyamag.com/politics/behind ... s-turn-now
The desecration of the murti (idol) of Shri Ram at the Sita Lakshmana Kothandarama Temple in Ramatheertham, which saw the temple priest being reduced to tears, on 28 December has brought the focus back on these attacks.

The temple is over 1,500 years old and unnerved, the YSRCRP government acted immediately by removing Raju as the Chairman of the temple trust, holding him responsible for the lax in security.
One of the reasons why the attacks have continued for the last 19 months on the temples is the Andhra Pradesh Home Minister Mekatoti Sucharita’s handling of these incidents.

A serious allegation against her is that she is a Christian and, therefore, actions against those who had damaged the temples have not been forthcoming easily.

That no one has been arrested all these months for the attack and charged or punished is itself an indicator of how things are handled by the YSRCP government, observers say.
A video that did the rounds on Twitter and WhatsApp last week showed a Tehsildar in Andhra Pradesh not being allowed to go atop a hill where an old temple of Goddess existed.

When the Tehsildar pointed out and said she wanted to visit it, a group of Christians said they had bought the hill and wouldn’t allow her.

Muns
Forum Moderator
Posts: 624
Joined: Mon Oct 02, 2017 6:01 am
Has thanked: 1 time
Been thanked: 5 times

Re: Christianity in India watch thread

Post by Muns » Mon Jan 25, 2021 3:11 am

Third in series of controversies of early Christian history by Bart D Ehrman.

Again, things are only points that I remember why listening to the series. This one is specifically more pertinent because it deals with Thomas, supposedly twin brother to Jesus himself.

Protestant Christian beliefs have no problems with the belief that Jesus had brothers. This is evidenced in the Gospels themselves. Mark 6.3
Catholic tradition holds that Jesus had cousins because of the virgin birth of Mary.

Some traditions hold that Joseph was too old when he married Mary to consummate.

The following are stories told from the Nag Hammadi Gospels from Qumran. Gospel of Thomas.
In this gospel, Thomas is identified to be the twin brother of Jesus.

After the death of Jesus, lots were taken to spread the word of Christianity.

Thomas, drew the lot to spread the word of Christianity to India.

He refused, and all the apostles try to convince him to go to India, which failed.

A king of India then sent an emissary to Jerusalem because they needed a carpenter.

Jesus descended from heaven, and said that I have a slave that I will sell to you being Thomas.

Thomas then reluctantly agreed to go to India.

Muns
Forum Moderator
Posts: 624
Joined: Mon Oct 02, 2017 6:01 am
Has thanked: 1 time
Been thanked: 5 times

Re: Christianity in India watch thread

Post by Muns » Sun Jan 31, 2021 11:48 pm

Often watch the History Channel to try and decompress. Couple things that I would like to post here just to highlight. After Charles I or Charlemagne came to power, as a Christian King one of his major acts was to try and convert forcibly those who was still worshiping the native religions of Europe. This largely involved those worshiping the Gods Woden and Donar of the Germanic tribes. For the Norse the same gods were known as Odin and Thor of Norse mythology.

This massive conversion especially included the Saxons living in Germany at the time as well as throughout his quite large empire. He was also made Emperor by the Pope towards the end of his reign. However, his brutal campaign against anyone who practiced native religions is quite legendary. Anyone who was caught worshiping in the native European religion was put to death. Anybody caught cremating bodies was killed. Anyone who refused baptism was killed. Anyone caught in native religion sites was killed.

Native sites such as the legendary Irminsul were destroyed. The campaign of utter terror, he violently converted much of the Germanic tribes.
There is even the massacre at Verden which lists that Charlemagne killed up to 4500 Saxons by beheading them in a single day. To this day the it remains in the consciousness of Germanic history. For days after this massacre to those would not submit to Christianity, the river Aller ran red with blood.

Chief among the Saxons being Widukind, was also said to have accepted baptism although they are stories of him escaping the battle of Verden and heading north towards Danish territory where he was given refuge by the Danish king Sigfred practicing Norse religion.

Shortly after that we start to see the Viking raids happening from the Norse countries including Denmark Sweden and Norway all across Christian sites. These raids are often described by historians as barbarians strictly for loot and plunder. The Vikings really did raid Monastery’s initially and especially all along the English coast which was already quite well known. Could it be that the Vikings drive was not just plunder the revenge of their coreligionists of the Germanic tribes? Later upon the death of Charlemagne, they turned back onto the Rhineland.

In any case, it seems apparent that once the massacre of Verden became known to the Norse and for the fact that they shared a central religion, these huge Viking raids then started to take place across much of Christianized world at the time in response to Charlemagne’s terror.
The Christians, long have a history of violent persecution of other religions throughout history even going back a few centuries earlier to when they became the primary religion of Rome after Constantine’s conversion and making Christianity the state religion of the Roman Empire.

Muns
Forum Moderator
Posts: 624
Joined: Mon Oct 02, 2017 6:01 am
Has thanked: 1 time
Been thanked: 5 times

Re: Christianity in India watch thread

Post by Muns » Wed Feb 03, 2021 7:19 am

Christian priest targets and converts Korwa tribal members to Christianity in Jharkhand

https://www.india-aware.com/latest/chri ... jharkhand/
The conversions have been taking place and people have been complaining a lot. Christian conversions are rampant in tribal areas these days as people are deliberately targeted there due to their vulnerability. A shocking incident of Christian conversion has come to light recently. A Bihar priest had been staying in Dhurki, Jharkhand for the past year, and along with two of his assistants, at least three Korwa tribal families had become Christian.

The Korwas are officially listed as a highly vulnerable tribal group. According to the villagers, in the past one year, over two dozen families from the Scheduled Tribal and Scheduled Caste communities have converted to Christianity in the past one year. According to sources, the Korwa tribal families were reportedly beaten and fined by the villagers.

Muns
Forum Moderator
Posts: 624
Joined: Mon Oct 02, 2017 6:01 am
Has thanked: 1 time
Been thanked: 5 times

Re: Christianity in India watch thread

Post by Muns » Wed Feb 17, 2021 6:40 am

The Real Number of Andhra Pradesh Christians Is Grossly Understated: Here’s Why

https://swarajyamag.com/politics/the-re ... -heres-why
In the last few years, there has been a spate of attacks on Hindu temples in Andhra Pradesh. This includes acts of vandalism, desecration and, in some cases, pyromania. Allegations have been traded back and forth, with Hindus claiming that this is the result of rampant conversions to Christianity, which, in turn, has created a population hostile to symbols of pagan faith.

We have also seen calls for giving the Hindu community the right to manage and protect their temples and a dismissal of such incidents as stray incidents involving petty criminals and mentally-disturbed individuals by Christians in the political and law enforcement leadership.

Muns
Forum Moderator
Posts: 624
Joined: Mon Oct 02, 2017 6:01 am
Has thanked: 1 time
Been thanked: 5 times

Re: Christianity in India watch thread

Post by Muns » Wed Feb 17, 2021 6:43 am

हिन्दुओ के मंदिरो पर आंध्रप्रदेश में क्यों बढ़ रहे हमले? क्यों किया जा रहा हिन्दुओ को परिवर्तित ?


Muns
Forum Moderator
Posts: 624
Joined: Mon Oct 02, 2017 6:01 am
Has thanked: 1 time
Been thanked: 5 times

Re: Christianity in India watch thread

Post by Muns » Mon Feb 22, 2021 6:40 am

Christian priest held for sexually assaulting a minor in Kerala

https://www.india-aware.com/latest/chri ... in-kerala/

Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk


Muns
Forum Moderator
Posts: 624
Joined: Mon Oct 02, 2017 6:01 am
Has thanked: 1 time
Been thanked: 5 times

Re: Christianity in India watch thread

Post by Muns » Wed Mar 03, 2021 7:04 am

“Evangelists built a Christian cross-shaped structure at Hindu holy site where Maa Sita left her footprints”: BJP

https://www.india-aware.com/national/ev ... rints-bjp/
BJP Andhra Pradesh National Secretary Sunil Deodhar tweeted with a photo of the unlawful act: “So see the big illegal Cross in Edlapadu, AP, where once there were #SitaMaa’s footprints. Lord Narasimhama carving is available at the back. Christian mafias created disasters in Guntur Dist. @BJP4Andhra and @friendsofrss demonstrated, but tacitly endorsed administration. #ChurchApproachment4”

In connection with this, Organiser reported that Hindus saw this place as sacred and rituals will take place here for centuries. However, Christians slowly came and began to demand Mary’s hill. The study even alleged that they also founded a church there after Jaganmohan Reddy came to power. Though the employees of BJP and RSS opposed it, the church was meant to be funded by one of the top bureaucrats and also a Christian. Finally, the footprint of Sita Maa was demolished and a large cross installed.

This area, it is said, bore the footprints of Sita, the goddess and a sculpture of Lord Narasimha has been demolished.

Muns
Forum Moderator
Posts: 624
Joined: Mon Oct 02, 2017 6:01 am
Has thanked: 1 time
Been thanked: 5 times

Re: Christianity in India watch thread

Post by Muns » Tue Sep 21, 2021 5:32 am

What a mess it has really been. Yet again Congress has managed to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory. All they really needed to do was to wait another six months with the captain that they held and they would’ve easily one another round of state elections. However, what is more concerning to me initially was the fact that Rahul Gandhi was reaching out to Ambika Soni.

She of course is a well-known Christian, who rejected the rule in favor of the Sikh leader. Within 24 hours Charanjit Singh Channi, has been sworn in as the sidekick to Navjot Singh Sidhu.
A further 24 hours later we start to see videos where both of them are in church, singing the praises of Jesus and more hallelujahs. Will see if can shift from whatsapp to here….

Add to this, Jagan Reddy, sweeping through Andhra Pradesh. Arvind Kejriwal, has also previously said at Christmas events that, the Delhi government has tried to model itself on the path of Jesus.
What it does show however is that there is a deep Christian nexus throughout the political class of India. It is a well-established structure throughout history convert the political elite and then over time enforcing policies in place to defund native religions worldwide.

Muns
Forum Moderator
Posts: 624
Joined: Mon Oct 02, 2017 6:01 am
Has thanked: 1 time
Been thanked: 5 times

Re: Christianity in India watch thread

Post by Muns » Thu Sep 23, 2021 5:03 am

X post from the political drama thread ; What I was alluding to above, with Channi at Church.

This is the reason Sonia Gandhi and Rahul appointed him as a CM. A plan by Soni and Siddhu in Punjab.

See the attached video

https://fb.watch/8b3SawSnaH/

Muns
Forum Moderator
Posts: 624
Joined: Mon Oct 02, 2017 6:01 am
Has thanked: 1 time
Been thanked: 5 times

Re: Christianity in India watch thread

Post by Muns » Sun Dec 05, 2021 9:39 pm

With regard to these new allegations in Karnataka. They seem to follow a common trend. The common trend usually is that churches are usually erected on illegal government land. Newly converted Christians to the faith seek to not only propagate the religion but make a mark on the landscape.
This usually means erection of large crosses for visual symbols of Christianity by local roads or on local hilltops.

When these activities are usually challenged by Hindus who have been living peacefully the location for numerous generations, Christians then claim persecution falsely as they have done since Roman times.

It remains to be seen whether the recent case in Belur, fits the trend. We will try to investigate with local VHP agencies on the ground if This is indeed what is going on locally.

The anti-conversion bill seems to have ruffled all of the Christian organizations in Karnataka who have recently decided to stage major protests. An ongoing issue that we should be well aware of.

Karnataka: Bajrang Dal men barge into Christian prayer hall over conversion allegations

https://indianexpress.com/article/citie ... l-7647377/

Post Reply